• Fringe look at a complete core input coil and impulse pressure waves

Fringe look at a complete core input coil and impulse pressure waves

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FringeIdeas posted this 21 June 2024

Hey everyone,

So my experiments for the study of the A Vector Potential, Fringe look at the A Vector Potential and rotating magnetic fields, are on hold for a bit while I acquire a few things and build a coil winding rig. It's well planned, I just need some time to make it happen.

In the meantime, I thought I could look into a few other relevant ideas. The input coil arrangement, and impulse discharges like that of a spark gap. Both of these ideas come from this part of this thread here, where Chris shows the output coils combined with the push pull input and GDT (gas discharge tube), and asks about what would happen if he wound a 7 turn input coil on the outside of the POC coil arrangement. And I am assuming Chris you mean on the outside around both output coils at the same time.

Originally here: Chris's Non-Inductive Coil Experiment

Continued a bit here:  Partnered Output Coils

Wrapping the input coil around both output coils has been used before by many, for example Don Smith.

 

This is interesting to me because, to me, having the input coil wrapped around only one POC seems unbalanced. Though I could be wrong. And there seemed to be quite a fight against the input during the regauge period which I believe can be minimized by arranging the input coil differently. Again, I could be wrong. Experiments will help clarify this for me.

The impulse discharge input has been used by many. Tesla, Tariel Kapanadze, etc. The disruptive nature of it is interesting, and for example the harmonics involved. I can't help but think this would be a good way to regauge the system.

Ok, so this is what I have so far..

The coils each have 3 layers of 16 turns = 48 turns of 0.4 mm speaker wire (copper itself is about 3mm).

The core is an AMCC800B.

The input coil will be roughly 12 turns of the same wire, as I intend to put a bit of focus on ¼ wavelength, near field, all of that good stuff. It will be wrapped around the whole core, both coils at the same time, like in the Don Smith picture.

I'll mess around with only pulses and push pull input at first, and then move on the GDT and possibly even a real spark gap.

So we know that POC coils provide us a way to apply a steady pressure on the electrons, to get them free/moving and accelerate them, pumping current, while also giving us a way to collect that energy. Or rather we are creating a condition to have nature do this process for us, we just set it in motion and collect the output.

So if I'm not mistaken, the next step would be to figure out a way to really knock a lot of electrons loose so we can really get some good action going. High magnetic fields, maybe some sharp jabs to the electrons. Hopefully these experiments, alongside my A Vector Potential experiments, will lead to learning.

More coming soon, thanks!

Marcel

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FringeIdeas posted this 21 June 2024

Chris, I do have one quick question.

The POC coils have diodes. So only one direction of input is actually going to wind them up and get their currents moving. A magnetic field in the opposite direction will be just a waste I assume.

So are we only wanting the GDT or spark gap to fire on one part of the AC cycle?

For example, the cycle starts and positive swing is used to ramp up the tank circuit voltage, but not yet reaching that breakdown area of the GDT. And then the negative swing further ramps up the tank circuit, this time reaching the breakdown voltage. So the spark would only fire on the negative swing.

I'll admit, I'm not familiar enough with how this spark gap idea works.

Thank you!

Marcel

Gucio posted this 21 June 2024

Very interesting. I once played with a choke with a bifilar winding from an ATX power supply. The phase-connected windings cause the magnetic fields in the core to attract each other and stay locked in the core. I connected the windings in parallel in antiphase, which forced the magnetic field to radiate outside the core and powered the Bedini motor. A diagram of what it looks like is shown below.

This bifilar coil worked very well as a drive for the Bedini engine.

I have this Bedini engine, still waiting for development

I was very wondering where such a strong impulse comes from in such a bifilar coil.
My colleague raised a very interesting topic. Please keep up the great work.

 

Grzegorz

Chris posted this 21 June 2024

Chris, I do have one quick question.

The POC coils have diodes. So only one direction of input is actually going to wind them up and get their currents moving. A magnetic field in the opposite direction will be just a waste I assume.

So are we only wanting the GDT or spark gap to fire on one part of the AC cycle?

For example, the cycle starts and positive swing is used to ramp up the tank circuit voltage, but not yet reaching that breakdown area of the GDT. And then the negative swing further ramps up the tank circuit, this time reaching the breakdown voltage. So the spark would only fire on the negative swing.

I'll admit, I'm not familiar enough with how this spark gap idea works.

Thank you!

Marcel

 

Hey Marcel,

Typically one polarity works better than the other, yes.

Best Wishes,

   Chris

FringeIdeas posted this 02 June 2025

Hey!

So with almost no bench time for a while, limited study time, and a bit of burnout from working too much for too long, I have decided to temporarily put aside the Melnichenko stuff and revisit this setup, shown by Chris, links above in the opening comment of this thread.


 
There seems to be a lot of attention on this particular setup lately. Real videos, honest attempts, fake nonsense that YouTube seems to be pushing. I left this setup alone, for the most part, because I was a little shy of getting into the push-pull to spark gap type input, and tuning. But it seems I can't ignore it forever. And there seems to be a strong push to discredit or confuse this setup. Which means it's probably something we should be looking at. 😀

Drasko's build, here.
Adam's build here.

Guys, thanks for your contributions and the motivation to dig in.

 

And this guy here, among other YouTube videos I've found.

 

Now this dude, all due respect if he is visiting this forum, but I can't help but notice a couple red flags. The coils seem to be hooked up strangely. He says in the comments that the red POC is the input, black the output, and I'm not sure about the large black outer coil. In a few comments these coils were asked about, one comment even using the term partnered output coils, and the questions seemed to be sidestepped and redirected. And the explanations of the operation seem to be, well, I don't resonate with them. Anyway, I have not successfully built this setup yet so right now I'm just yapping. But enough about this guy, that's not the point of this post.

 

In about a week and a half my wife will take the kids to see family and I'll take a little time off work. Paint the deck, de-weed the yard, and throw on some Sublime or Bob Marley nice and loud while I wind coils. I should have about two weeks of bench time and no work. So I'm preparing now.

Mouser is shipping me a few things, and I'll start printing some formers in a day or two. My old build pictured in my first post is shelved. I have a slightly smaller core coming and different wire, mosfets, etc.

I started putting together a push-pull input, and thinking of alternate types of input, just to get the electronics in place and ready. My first question is in regards to "tuning". I'm guessing I want to first find the frequency where the POCs buck nicely and have the effect of aiding the input. Then I want to target that frequency when I'm designing the resonant point of my push-pull circuit, or whatever style input circuit I use. Correct? So the spark itself is at that frequency, not necessarily the frequency which builds the resonance rise.

 

BTW Drasko, I had just noticed your mosfet reading through your thread again, IXFN180N20. That's a beast!

So any advice at this point, while I'm in the design phase, would be appreciated. Building starts in less than two weeks. Finally, some bench time. I'll be sure to share.

Thanks!
Marcel

Chris posted this 03 June 2025

Hey Marcel,

I believe Perspective is a very important. 

A Coil of Wire, connected to a Globe, the Globe wont light, but wave a Permanent Magnet past the Coil of Wire fast enough, the Globe will Light.

We have some key words to think about:

  • A Coil of Wire
  • a Globe
  • a Permanent Magnet

 

and of course the rate at which the PM travels, we get Light!

The Perspective is key! Key to advancing this: 2025 - 1831 = 194 Year old Technology. We must take this very simple Perspective one step further, making this Asymmetrical, Breaking the Symmetry that has been enforced on us for so long, the Symmetry of Below Unity Machines, because the only way we progress, is to learn how to take advantage of Chiral Nature.

Let Each Force of each M.M.F, become a Functional Power Output.

Its all about Matching the M.M.F, POCOne and POCTwo must have equal and Opposite M.M.F or this does not work.

On the Spark Gap:

A spark gap transmitter doesn't just emit a single frequency; it generates a wide spectrum of frequencies, including harmonics. These harmonics are multiples of the fundamental frequency, meaning the signal contains the base frequency and frequencies that are 2x, 3x, 4x, and so on, of that base frequency. 

 

I was hoping someone would point this out, but no one has, so there are benefits to using a Spark Gap!

Best Wishes,

   Chris

FringeIdeas posted this 13 June 2025

Hey!

Thanks for the words of wisdom Chris. I was thinking something similar about the spark gap, but wasn't sure. Still little experience with them. There was something else you had said in another thread, and I'm sorry but I can't remember, nor can I find, where you had said this. But you mentioned in an inductive discharge the voltage is immediate and the current ramps up. With a capacitive discharge it's the opposite. The current is immediate and the voltage ramps up. I had never heard that before. And if we think of the current being the magnetic field, that is a rather important statement.

Anyway, slowly getting things together here. Front end build and testing starts next week. The core and wires are now ready.

Some details and a picture:

 

Core is an AMCC-320. I decided on a bit smaller core just because it's easier to work with. 3D printed the bobbins, 3mm thickness. Length is about 75mm windable space. Cross sectional area is 2.5cm x 5.5cm = 13.75cm2.

The wire is silicon power wire, 2.5mm2. This equates to a 1.8mm diameter wire core + 2mm insulation = total wire diameter of ~3.8mm. The black appears to be the copper type, while the blue appears to be the aluminum type. So the blue might have a slightly higher resistance, but on this short of length I'm not going to worry about it too much.

Each POC is 20 turns x 2 layers = 40 turns. One clockwise the other counter clockwise, traditional POCs.

The input coil in blue, same specs. There are 10 total turns which would be ¼ the wire length of both POC coil lengths together. In the center at 5 turns I have a tap. This is ¼ the wire length of one POC. I just threw that in there to play with.

I have purchased new mosfets, a few capacitors, a new small core for the push pull circuit etc. I'll probably get to that on Monday. I had messed around with a few configurations last week and had a nice little push pull resonating 10V up to around 140, triggering the GDT rated for about 104V I believe. But I didn't have the coils built yet, so I had used a temp input coil to play with, and resonance was around 45KHz. So I want to play with that, maybe bring it down a bit.

Also Adam had chimed in on Drasko's thread with this.. Here

Now this is the part I think most don’t see:
Then the series resonant circuit building up must be in sync with the primary discharge circuit or so to say the two resonant circuits must be in resonance with each other.
Two resonant circuits resonating at the exact same time!
Otherwise they will hit each other trying to charge the same cap in reverse polarity at some point costing lots of input energy.

So, a bit to think about while designing the front end.

Anyway, small steps forward, let's see where this goes. I'll post my progress.

Thanks!

Marcel

Plasmonic posted this 14 June 2025

Hey Marcel,

Awesome build, as usual!

I reread your first post on this thread and I agree with your following statement.

FringeIdeas:

This is interesting to me because, to me, having the input coil wrapped around only one POC seems unbalanced. Though I could be wrong. And there seemed to be quite a fight against the input during the regauge period which I believe can be minimized by arranging the input coil differently. Again, I could be wrong. Experiments will help clarify this for me.

  I remembered an experiment where I used the same core you've seen me use in the past, I believe it's an AMCC 200, maybe 100.  I had wound 45 turns in a single layer of about 20AWG magnet wire, one coil on each leg and wound a 12AWG primary around the entire core, I believe 6 turns.  I didn't spend a ton of time with it because I completed the setup I was going for that you have also seen using the typical setup you point out in the first sentence.

One thing I noticed though while swapping things around that I find interesting because of my current line of thinking which is around Kapanadze style devices using floating LC resonance, Avremenko plugs (single wire transmission and rectification) but taking it a tad bit farther based on some research I have come across.

So my point!  I was doing some precursory experiments (I didn't get to test much with it on a scope), so I don't know much more than what I'm about to say, which is, I was trying to drive the coil as we normally try to do here and trying to get my output power up so I could use light bulb output for discovery before putting the scope on it.

I disconnected one of the POCs with my bare hands while it was running (NOT WISE!).  When I did it though, the coil I disconnected basically turned into a tesla coil with soft white and blue sparks and a light blue field around them, the sparks coming off the terminals would go through the magnet wire insulation to complete it's connection, if the wires were parallel the sparks would fairly evenly distribute themselves along the wires based on their proximity.  They would actively spark between the wires with a gap of up to about 10mm.  Some of this stuff I saw is not wildly different from some precautions you may hear about transformers like the voltage being able to exceed it's rating if it's open circuit on the output of the transformer but it's always been interesting that it basically turned into a tesla coil with very few turns of wire.

In my case I didn't feel a single tingle from all of the electrical action despite at least 1 hand basically being involved with the sparks, I didn't touch the sparks but was holding one of the wires to move it around and see what I described.  I should have been shocked.  There was an impressive voltage rise which is something I'm very keyed in on atm because of the single wire floating system I'm working on that is based on displacement current. 

(DONT TRY THIS AT HOME KIDS!)

I appreciated re-reading your first post as it's given me something I should go back and explore applying to the experiment I'm working on now.  May make a very nice upgrade from my vehicle ignition coil I picked up for some preliminary testing. Which I hope to do in the next couple weeks.

Just so I don't add too much mystery in my diatribe of why the quote stuck out to me.  I'll share this.

Avremenko plug basic (tesla style):

 

The one I'm working on:

 

Current goal is to base feed a floating 3rd coil via a spark gap which would (hopefully) supply a strong oscillation to the antenna connection to have a displace current oscillation between the antenna and the #2 conductive body.  While using the circuit above in series with the oscillation.

Deep breath

Hope I made enough sense, that was a sorta spontaneous uncontained post, but Awesome work!  I'll hopefully have some things to share soon but be careful with those connections, but there may be some interesting things that I think are hiding in what you're soon to be using.  I look forward to it!  Be safe.

Godspeed,

Matt

 

FringeIdeas posted this 14 June 2025

Hey Plasmonic,

Thanks! And I do remember the Avremenko plug thing from way back in the day. I never did mess around with it all that much. I did have some success with the one wire transmission using the Tesla coil type setup. Quite a bit of experimenting with that back then. But the output always seemed to push back on the input. There was some dude by the name of EMJunkie back then. 😉 But I didn't get a chance to study the partnered output coils. I had a nasty divorce and put down the studies for a decade. Wish I would have kept up with it, I wouldn't be paying 600e/month right now for electricity.

As far as this setup is concerned, I'm not going high voltage with it just yet. I have gas discharge tubes rated for around 100V to start. After that if I feel I understand the tuning and concepts of the spark gap, I have another set of GDTs rated at around 300V. Also a couple beefy thyristors and SRCs I might throw in the mix at some point. I think that should be sufficient to prove out concepts. But let's see.

Marcel

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Chris posted this 15 June 2025

Hey Marcel and other readers,

My Friend, you have some good points and the conversation with Matt has bought up some really good thoughts.

Lets touch on some of the points:

Quite a bit of experimenting with that back then. But the output always seemed to push back on the input.

 

Yes, this is true, and yes a Voltage can only be "Generated" if the Magnetic Field is aloud to move! If the Magnetic Field is Held Steady, then No Voltage can be "Generated". The Common Mode and Differential Mode Chokes show this. Delay the Conduction, switch in at say 12.7 Volts, and then the Voltage in the System will be Regulated by Magnetic Field Means.

 

There was some dude by the name of EMJunkie back then. 😉 But I didn't get a chance to study the partnered output coils.

 

Haha yeah some Crazy Guy, with Crazy ideas, and so many people tried to Shoot it all down, until it was shown that it worked exactly as I was telling people:

Many here laugh at, and mok EMJ, but the fact is , he is basically right in what he is trying to put forward.

http://overunity.com/15395/partnered-output-coils-free-energy/msg460945/#msg460945

 

 Everyone is looking only at the electrical output of my device,and seem to be ignoring the mechanical output that is also there.
 They also dismiss EMJ's shorted coil theory,and although he hasnt shown a working device yet,and he messed up the scope measurements,his theory is sound.

http://overunity.com/15395/partnered-output-coils-free-energy/msg453458/#msg453458

 

 

   PM

 How closely do you think this is starting to resemble EMJs partnered output coil setup?,as i am seeing some resemblance here.


 Brad

http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=3319.msg57155#msg57155

 

 

I think it is time Grum,to answer this question once and for all.

For every action,there is an equal and opposite reaction--and then there is the counter reaction

Open the topic,and lets get ION on the scene ,as he knows his way around calorimetry setup's,and i believe this is the way to show PMs doing useful work.


Brad

http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=3319.msg56743#msg56743

 

 


How did I know? Hmm, well, sometimes one has to Break the Water in the Pond before Jumping in, or one may break their back on entry. So many before me failed to start others on the True Path.

 

I had a nasty divorce and put down the studies for a decade.

 

Oh man, I am sorry to hear!

 

As far as this setup is concerned, I'm not going high voltage with it just yet. I have gas discharge tubes rated for around 100V to start. After that if I feel I understand the tuning and concepts of the spark gap, I have another set of GDTs rated at around 300V. Also a couple beefy thyristors and SRCs I might throw in the mix at some point. I think that should be sufficient to prove out concepts. But let's see.

 

Think Force in terms of MMF, as each POC Bucks the other, the Force of the Bucking, Opposition, is what Pumps Current. To have MMF, you need a Voltage First.

Voltage is the direct Change in the Magnetic Field of the Source, from T=0 to T=CurrentPeak, of the Source, and the Turns, Voltage is multiplied by each turn, E.G: 1 turn = 1 volt, then 100 turns = 100 volts. This you all know, but putting this all together, these relationships are very tight, intimately related, and as we see in a transformer, we see direct opposition, from Output to Input, and as the Load Resistance Decreases, we see the Currents Go Up, and the Impedance Drops, allowing for the increase in Current, well the same occurs in the POC, the Impedance drops as Load Increases.

At perfect Resonance, Voltages are generated in the POC, or we can use other means to make this occur.

Do you remember the Story of the Vacuum Cleaner I told you guys? I lost about 1.5Cm's of 0.8mm wire in one experiment. So be careful.

Best Wishes,

   Chris

FringeIdeas posted this 19 June 2025

Hey!

I've been slowly messing around with this setup for a few days now. Here is a pic of the mess.

 

 

The push pull input circuit is a ferrite E core, simply so I could gap it to help increase the output voltage. The two coils on the left are both 20 turns of 1.2mm wire, and the output is 40 turns 1.2mm wire. So a 1:2 step up. While in resonance with the cap I can get the voltages up to roughly 250-300 Vpp, depending on the cap that I use. I'm playing around with the 1uF microwave cap and some others I had purchased, ranging down to 15 nF. So with a peak resonance value of 125-150 Vp it's enough to jump the gas discharge tube which is rated for 100 V (maybe 90 actually, but let's say 100).

For the primary on the output coils, I've been using only the 10 turns, not the 5 turn tap. The two POC coils I have in series going into a 3W bulb. It's interesting to see the resonance build up. Single trigger shot here..

 

 

And a zoom in, with cursors, where the spark discharge happens and the resonance build's up again. The trumpet wave.

 

 

Now, something I'm struggling with.. There are two different spark gap configurations that have been mentioned. A couple links for fun:

ARRL: How Spark Transmitters Work

Tesla Colorado Springs Notes, go to about page 56 (in the text).

 

 

Maybe I'm holding it wrong, but I can't get the GDT to trigger with configuration A. Even with a 300 Vpp (150 Vp) which is well over the GDT rating of 100V. The trumpet wave scope shots above are from configuration B. 

Tesla, in the Colorado Spring notes, mentioned that configuration B had a tendency to dampen the waves rather fast, so he went on to a configuration similar to A. But to my understanding so far, we want one sharp discharge in one direction. Like with the single pulse into the non-inductive coil experiment setup. We are not looking to build LC oscillations in the output primary. So I'm heavily leaning towards configuration B. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Interestingly enough though, with both configurations, removing the load from the POCs has little to no effect on the input power. 

So, I'm still playing around here. Moving rather slow. It seems there is a lot to learn for me. Where to next.. Adam had mentioned, and this makes total sense to me, to configure the spark gap so that the trumpet wave matches the regauge plus the output time periods. And I'm going to use his picture. Plagiarism! Muhaha! Kidding, thanks Adam for laying out your thoughts! Link to your thread, starting about here.

 

 

So adjusting the coil and/or cap parameters, we can probably achieve this pretty easily. I'll steal Adam's pictures again. 😈 Finding the open end resonance like this.. My current POC setup has an open end resonance of 230 KHz.

 

 

Then calculating the ¼ wave time period, like this, which would give me a quarter wave time period of 1 uS.

 

 

We should have a good idea of what our rise time (input on time) should be for the POCs. Then that correlates to our spark period. My push pull is running at roughly 10 KHz. My whole time period, from spark-> re-resonate-> spark is roughly 1 mS. I think that is way too long. 

Question, is it possible to adjust the actual spark time? Is this spark time "on" directly related to how much energy is stored in the capacitor? Smaller cap = smaller spark time.

My issue is, with the non-inductive coil experiment setup, I always had to just sweep around, shorting and un-shorting one of the POCs to find that frequency and duty cycle where the POCs started working together. I never did find a mathematical correlation between the ¼ wave open end resonance of the POCs, and what frequency/duty cycle I ended up with in the end.

So.. more to learn here. Sweeping around to find the correct time period of the trumpet wave isn't going to be so easy if I'm having to change caps and add/remove coil turns all the time. I think I will revisit the math, and maybe I can narrow down what frequencies I'm looking for.

Also, I may be experiencing what Adam had talked about, where the cap when it discharges, wants to charge in the opposite polarity and stuffs the next resonant cycle. When the spark gap starts firing, I do notice a rise of input. Sometimes it's quite large, for example, from 2 amps to 5 amps.

Ok, enough blabbering, I'll be playing around a bit more with the math and cap sizes for now.

Thanks!

Marcel

Plasmonic posted this 21 June 2025

Man, Marcel,

Don't stop!

I've been thinking about this a bit and I wanted to share some ideas that came to me.   If you want a faster discharge you may be able to use lower voltage GDTs (73V is the lowest I have come across) and run them in series.  GDTs may have the same effect as a normal series spark gap like is used in the Tesla coil community, I think it was something Tesla used for a time as well.

Also it may be an option to lower your capacitance and increase your trigger voltage.  You would be able to keep the energy quantity the same but should have a faster discharge rate, not a perfect solution but maybe better?

I'll keep thinking about this, nice work btw!

Stay Awesome,

Matt

Drasko posted this 21 June 2025

Hey Marcel,

Looking good, glad to see progress and experimentation.

Regarding this Question:

Question, is it possible to adjust the actual spark time? Is this spark time "on" directly related to how much energy is stored in the capacitor? Smaller cap = smaller spark time.

Do some research on Magnetic Quenching by Nikola Tesla.

Using a strong magnetic field and inserting the spark gap between it will affect the "on" time.

This is directly from google:

In Tesla coils, magnetic quenching refers to using a strong magnetic field to quickly extinguish the spark in a spark gap, allowing for faster and more efficient oscillations. This is achieved by placing magnets near the spark gap, so that the magnetic field interacts with the arc, disrupting it and causing it to collapse. This rapid quenching enables the capacitor to recharge and the cycle to repeat more quickly, leading to higher spark rates and better overall performance

Spark Gap

I believe by adjusting the distance of the magnets will influence the rate at which the spark gap is extinguished which in turn changes the "on" time. The image above is the actual apparatus. The "M" is mica insulating paper to ensure spark doesn't spark over to the magnets. N and S being the two magnetic fields attracting each other. A and B are the terminals of the spark gap.

Opposing magnetic fields may work as well, but will have to get to this step before experimenting with it, just a theory.

Also posted by Chris on my post:

Follow the Ideas in Nikola Tesla's Spark Gap Discharges and you'll go a long way!

 

I'm currently experimenting with the setup I posted using just a Mosfet(yes the beast lol) and seeing the effects and trying to understand them before going to the next step. I will post some data as I find time. Been a bit hectic the last few weeks/months. And apologies to all who I haven't replied to on my original post. Every time someone makes a post it leads to hours/days/weeks of research and experimentation.

Hope this helps!

Thanks,

Drasko.

 

Edit:

Good read.

https://waveguide.blog/teslas-spark-gaps-literature-review/

Adam posted this 22 June 2025

Hello,

 

Remember you have two separate cores the first core is resonating your voltage up until the spark gap jumps. Now on the second core the primary fires and the two POC coils buck but as soon as the two coils buck they are also sort of bucking the primary which reverse charges the capacitor. Remember at the same time your first core is still resonating and wants to charge the shared capacitor at the same moment the primary on the second core wants to reverse charge that same capacitor. So we have a bit of a conundrum here, how do we get both cores to charge the shared capacitor in the same polarity at the same moment in time on the first pulse after the spark gap discharge?

 

If we don’t get this to happen then each core will try to charge the same capacitor in reverse polarity and basically buck each other’s input charge resulting in huge input power consumption and disaster.

 

But if we do get this to happen correctly then the primary over the POC coils will reverse charge the capacitor 2/3 of the way full and your first core can finish the 1/3 charge in resonance very easily and cheaply with almost no input.

 

Both cores have to charge the same capacitor at the same moment in time in the same polarity on the first pulse after the spark gap discharge. This is the key !

 

Chris, how do you feel about this explanation please feel free to chime in.

 

Adam.

FringeIdeas posted this 22 June 2025

Hey, sorry, been busy the last few days catching up on some house work, painting, whatnot. And we just had mid-summers here in Finland. But glad to see a few comments and discussion!

@Plasmonic Thanks man! And yes, I have been playing with putting the GDTs in series, parallel, etc. I think mine are actually rated for 90V. I'm not sure I want to go much lower than that. The lowering of capacitance is what I'm going to mess with next. But like I mentioned before, I'm not exactly sure in what time period I want the discharge to happen.

@Drasko Magnetic quenching was in my mind as well. I had noticed that while going through some of Tesla's writings. I wasn't sure I wanted to mess with that just yet, as I'm still very new to the spark gap, but it seems like an interesting idea to experiment with, so I'll add it to the list. Thanks. Interested in seeing your progress, thanks for the link on the spark gaps I'll check it out, and thanks for the comments.

@Adam Very clear description thank you. And, while struggling with a bit of brain fog today due to mid-summers activities (beer) here in Finland yesterday, I would like to throw a thought out. If the reverse charge from the POCs begins when the spark discharge ends, then we could simply time where the reverse charge begins by changing the length of the spark discharge. So.. for example, make sure the spark discharge is ¼ the length of one input resonant cycle. So the discharge ends at the 0 crossing. Not sure if ¼ would be correct, again brain fog, but I hope you understand what I'm saying. Again, thanks for jumping in, I appreciate the thoughts. 

So.. it kind of looks like the discharge time should be looked at closer. Not just the time, but with respect to the oscillations of the resonance. When I get some time, today or tomorrow, I'll get back to that. 

Thanks everyone!

Marcel

Chris posted this 22 June 2025

Hey Guys, this is great to see!

@Adam, re:

Chris, how do you feel about this explanation please feel free to chime in.

 

My Friend, I have always appreciated you and your hard work. I can be a Bull Headed Prick sometimes, and for that I am sorry.

Thank You to all of you!

Best Wishes,

   Chris

Adam posted this 23 June 2025

Thank you Chris,

I really appreciate all your hard work and all of the free information you have given out to us over the many years. Not many people in the world would be willing to do that. In Fact you are the only one. lol

 

Well, I suppose in regards to understanding the principle of how the full system works the cat is out of the bag. lol  minus the grounding so you can pump!

 

I think we know that the number of turns between the primary wrapped over the bucking coils it somewhere around ¼ of the turns to 1/3 turns. Meaning quarter wave as Don states. It always seems to be a few more turns than 1/4 for me.

 

I suppose the next question people should look at is. How do we determine the number of turns of wire on core one “the resonance core” versus  the primary turns on core two “the bucking core” ?

 

Maybe Chris has found an easy answer to this question?

 

Have fun

Adam.

 

 

Chris posted this 24 June 2025

Hey guys,

@Adam - Your Query:

I suppose the next question people should look at is. How do we determine the number of turns of wire on core one “the resonance core” versus  the primary turns on core two “the bucking core” ?

 

Maybe Chris has found an easy answer to this question?

 

As we know, the "Pumping" Property, ( of Fundamental Charge ), is, in itself the Bucking of POCOne and POCTwo, and yes, we do sometimes have to have a Ground, which we learned from back in the Akula days, needs to be approximately the same length of both POC.

The answer to your question, unfortunately is: Trial and error.

Best Wishes,

   Chris

Chris posted this 25 June 2025

Hey Guys,

The POC Voltage, as we know, the difference in Potential from Terminal One and Terminal Two, is the Total Electromotive Force: E.M.F.

Why the ground and why the same length?

The Wave on the Grounding point, will be Zero Potential relative to ground. So one side of the POC has a Ground Zero Potential, and the other terminal can become any Potential X, above or Below the Ground Potential.

Why do we have very Little Voltage Generated?

Back to the Common mode / Differential mode Chokes situation...

We all know, if POCOne and POCTwo are both Loaded at all times, very little Voltage can be "Generated" unless we have perfect Magnetic Resonance!

So how do we get around the Ground?

Well, this is the trick! By Allowing the Voltage to go up, and switching in at a specific time, more on this soon, but in the meantime, Imagine the two pieces of wire I have been showing for a long time now, this representation of POCOne and POCTwo :

 

 

So, POCOne gains a voltage of 12.0 Volts, The Load is applied, POCTwo must the automatically carry the same Current, if we have Magnetic Resonance, because Electromagnetic Induction does actually work, even though those dumb ass*s over on the other forums have Zero Understanding of it, and we have a Pump, where Charge is freed and Accelerated down the wire, like we saw in the Mr Preva Experiment!

 

I hope Readers understand what I am saying here!

Best Wishes,

   Chris

 

FringeIdeas posted this 27 July 2025

Hey! No real update on this build just yet, still playing around. Just wanted to post something more for fun.

I spent a bit of time last night before bed trying to find some of the old free energy videos on YouTube, partially because Netflix is a huge waste of time, and partially because it's interesting to go back and see if I can spot information that I have learned on the forum here.

WITTS came up. And I'll be honest, WITTS, the way they present themselves, has always seemed to me kind of snake oil salesman-ish.. Kind of like Denis Lee. BUT, regarding both of these parties, if one looks closely enough, they seem to have enough evidence to show that their technologies were/are the real deal.

WITTS for example, and this was just strange because we have a few people now, including myself, working on this spark gap primary setup. Recent talk has been on the trumpet waveform and the use of a proper ground. This WITTS replication of the split flux transformer, video here

There are several interesting things that can be noted in the video, but the kicker was at the end..

 

Now don't go throwing any money at WITTS. I'm just posting this because the timing of me finding this video was just interesting.

Marcel

Forelle posted this 31 July 2025

Hey everyone,

So my experiments for the study of the A Vector Potential, Fringe look at the A Vector Potential and rotating magnetic fields, are on hold for a bit while I acquire a few things and build a coil winding rig. It's well planned, I just need some time to make it happen.

In the meantime, I thought I could look into a few other relevant ideas. The input coil arrangement, and impulse discharges like that of a spark gap. Both of these ideas come from this part of this thread here, where Chris shows the output coils combined with the push pull input and GDT (gas discharge tube), and asks about what would happen if he wound a 7 turn input coil on the outside of the POC coil arrangement. And I am assuming Chris you mean on the outside around both output coils at the same time.

Originally here: Chris's Non-Inductive Coil Experiment

Continued a bit here:  Partnered Output Coils

Wrapping the input coil around both output coils has been used before by many, for example Don Smith.

 

This is interesting to me because, to me, having the input coil wrapped around only one POC seems unbalanced. Though I could be wrong. And there seemed to be quite a fight against the input during the regauge period which I believe can be minimized by arranging the input coil differently. Again, I could be wrong. Experiments will help clarify this for me.

The impulse discharge input has been used by many. Tesla, Tariel Kapanadze, etc. The disruptive nature of it is interesting, and for example the harmonics involved. I can't help but think this would be a good way to regauge the system.

Ok, so this is what I have so far..

The coils each have 3 layers of 16 turns = 48 turns of 0.4 mm speaker wire (copper itself is about 3mm).

The core is an AMCC800B.

The input coil will be roughly 12 turns of the same wire, as I intend to put a bit of focus on ¼ wavelength, near field, all of that good stuff. It will be wrapped around the whole core, both coils at the same time, like in the Don Smith picture.

I'll mess around with only pulses and push pull input at first, and then move on the GDT and possibly even a real spark gap.

So we know that POC coils provide us a way to apply a steady pressure on the electrons, to get them free/moving and accelerate them, pumping current, while also giving us a way to collect that energy. Or rather we are creating a condition to have nature do this process for us, we just set it in motion and collect the output.

So if I'm not mistaken, the next step would be to figure out a way to really knock a lot of electrons loose so we can really get some good action going. High magnetic fields, maybe some sharp jabs to the electrons. Hopefully these experiments, alongside my A Vector Potential experiments, will lead to learning.

More coming soon, thanks!

Marcel

Hi Marcel and everyone

Do you know Genady Markov Alexandrovich Pat.EP 0844626A1 ?

https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/pdfs/c1bfd5a0b0186c858067/EP0844626A1.pdf

It works best if all 3 windings are on the same coil.Be carefull because with a 1:1:1 Relation you get really high voltage.

Good Day

FringeIdeas posted this 2 weeks ago

Hey!

Managed to get a little bit of bench time over the past couple days. I'll be moving back to this impulse pressure wave experiment, explanation in a bit.

In Chris's thread Reflected Impedance, here, I liked the idea of using a snubber circuit to delay the conduction of a diode. Messed with it a bit yesterday, no dice. I'll get back to it later. But then reading more in the thread IMPORTANT: The 2.8 GHz Quantum-Classical Resonance Bridge, starting here, and the next post, and the whole thread really, Chris is mentioning high voltage and using a spark gap again. Then this came to mind.

 

 

The high voltage from the excitation coils just seems like it needs to spark. And to direct that into the input coil just seems appropriate. I would use the word "obvious" but I could be completely wrong with what I'm thinking.

So I have the T1 and T2 coils over my excitation coils, but not in series like Floyd Sweet has them. I'm alternating them with square wave pulses, 50% duty cycle. That initially acts the same as the scalar north would when it comes out of the adjacent P1 and P2 coils. The excitation coils then get into LC resonance with their capacitors and jump the gas discharge tube over to the opposite input/FB coil, which at that point in time is in its regauge period. For now I have picked a capacitor for each excitation coil that resonates at about the same frequency where the POC coils seem to output the most light on the bulb. Around 1.3 KHz.

Nothing super special to report for now. Which is why I'm posting this in this thread on the impulse pressure wave. I think I need to get back to this experiment first. I left off with it not working properly. The timing of the spark and the reverse charge from the output coil I think is off. I never considered the wire lengths and antenna ideas. To be honest I'm not exactly sure. But I do realize now that I need to understand this. Adam had mentioned a few important things, links in a few posts above. I need to re-read and re-think this spark gap circuit. I'll probably have a few questions soon once I dig back in. So for now, back to this setup.

 

 

And I'm not looking to run my house with this, I just feel it's critical to understand. A COP=1.1 with this setup would be just fine with me. Once I fully understand this then I think it's just a matter of implementing the same idea to the Floyd Sweet setup. Of course, as always, I could be completely off here.

@Drasko, if you are around, I'm curious if you have had any progress with the spark gap quenching? For fun I tried asking google AI how to stop the reverse charging of the capacitor in a spark gap circuit, and it mentioned spark quenching. I thought of your thread.

@Chris in your thread/post, here, you mention "did you notice that?". Sorry, you lost me with that. Are you just referring to the mentions of Floyd Sweet using high voltage, or are you referring to something specific in one of the pictures?

And just out of curiosity, has anyone ever question why in Don Smith's setup, there are disconnected wires? I think I remember seeing similar with AValon, possibly elsewhere. 

 

 

My mind wants to unwrap the wires and put them up on a pole. Dipole antenna.

Thanks!

Marcel

Chris posted this 2 weeks ago

Hey Marcel,

I believe you're on the right track! I am still investigating some of this field.

I think the quote I gave is important to understand:

Antenna Theory and Electron Spin Resonance, or Electron Paramagnetic Resonance all come from Wave Mechanics and are a Result of Wave Mechanics, if you like Experiments proving that Wave Mechanics are correct and hold water!

 

The Antenna and EPR are the Effect of Wave Mechanic's, Schrödinger's Wave Equation:

 

At Resonance, we get Maximum Amplitude, as we all know, but we get the minimum Impedance also, most dont think about this part. This is where the Flow of Current has the least Impedance and can flow much more freely! This is what Floyd Sweet talked about:

Resonance frequencies may be maintained quite constant at high power levels so long as the load remains constant. We are all familiar with AM and FM propagation, where in the case as AM, the voltage amplitude varies, and with FM, the frequency is modulated.

 However, the output power sees a constant load impedance, that of the matched antenna system. If this changes, the input to the antenna is mismatched, and standing waves are generated resulting in a loss of power.

 

I believe the Frequency of the HV should be at the Fundamental Coils Frequency, so for example, if the POC are Resonant at 680KHz, then the HV Source should be 680KHz, this is my opinion.

The Sub-Harmonic can be any of the lower something like λ/50:

 

Kind time of day. Maybe here we will find a common language. At once I will say that I do not sit at forums much. No time ! However, now for the 5th time I am collecting Akulin for a capacity increase. There are ideas .... But in fact the people are looking for a bit of everything is not right. All these systems operate on the basis of standing and traveling waves. It is necessary first to catch the motion of particles in the coil. Those. as Kapanadze does with a tester or an ammeter. Only at HF frequencies no ammeter will help and you will need to catch an oscilloscope. The first rule: Wind the coil 40 meters. 2. Find out its resonant frequency (1/4 wave) Inductor 1/4 = 10 meters of the same wire (for example, 2.5mm) Connect the generator to a 10 meter coil, drive the rectangles at a frequency of 1 MHz and crawl higher until 40 meters do not appear sinusoid. The maximum amplitude. The generator is desirable to take a normal, laboratory! With output adjustment from 0 to 20 volts. We achieve maximum amplitude and move tenths of a kilohertz until it starts to dance. This is your wave resonance !!! We fix the frequency and voltage. It is for this all have to do the generators. Further ... Tesla we shake under this frequency that the effect has turned out. Then we do everything as I did or the Shark. In this case, everyone wants to repeat this device. Forward! We fix everything beautifully and stiffly, without forgetting that the resonance and effect can escape in the case of fastenings on the snot. We need to get the effect itself and work, and not a ready device. Once you begin to understand what to do next, you can already move. So .... Tesla, as we know, also wets the sinusoid. Suppose your frequency is 1.821MHz. The frequency, but alas. It is necessary to adjust Tesla on it. The shark used a critic between Tesla and the toroid (Antenna) over the inductor. This is just an accurate adjustment. It is needed before launching. Then the system holds and no matter what has slipped in not large limits. But! Again ... What where? On the Inductor we feed the signal of rectangles with a frequency of 1/50. Consider: 1820: 50 = 36.4 kHz pumping a rectangle through the junction (Pot) with 23-29 turns of wire 2.5 squares. I repeat, you need to make the voltage on this harmonic not 10-20 volts, but higher by an order of magnitude. Approximately up to 50-60 volts and get the same dancing effect at the output. Further ! Do not forget that Tesla does not need strong power. Do not let sparks run and wet so that it breaks through. This is not necessary !!! It's better to make a controlled Tesla. Continue: The output voltage will be 195-200 volts. This voltage will not be higher. Why? Later we will return to this. It is necessary to rewind the transformer-reactor (Coil) so as to obtain the desired voltage. This requires experiments. Remember that we push the current in the reactor with a transverse wave. Created by Tesla. In the coil another wave is formed under the action of pumping by rectangles. The particles of which constantly rotate left and right. By giving them the movement of the pulsating Tesla, we disperse them in the very conductor. This is a gemmoroid understanding, but a fact. Tesla must operate in one half-cycle or one arm of the transistor. It is advisable to manage the Tesla pack - pulse generator. When everything is clearly adjusted, you will see how the effect manifests when changing the width of the pack. Consumption Tesla is scanty, and pumping does not strain at all. The current at the output is up to 7 amperes and the voltage is 200-209 volts. Bulbs and PSU pulses work well. Now for removal: 1. The coil is connected via a diode bridge. No parallel capacitors !!! 2. You need from Tesla only one half wave. Otherwise Tesla will take what she gave, back !!! Therefore, and put the diode from the ground to the very take-off coil (40m) The shark did this at the reception. He removed one part of the sine at the reception itself. Because Tesla. No one knows this and -bip-tsya to this day, nichrome does not work. It's clear! You need to swing the swing in the coil of energy removal. It is there that we push the current. By the way, the surplus from Tesla and the frequency setting of the Shark used a simple light bulb. Since the Inductor is galvanically isolated from the entire circuit, the light bulb serves as a resistive load to suppress surplus from cords and pickups. You can not bet, but do not rock Tesla very much. Do not ! Remember that the current is subject to voltage. This I see from experiments that I spent 2 more years ago. Next: The diode on the receiving take-off coil destroys one half-cycle and so we swing the oscillations without hindering them by the negative Tesla period. This, too, many do not know and continue to sculpt. That's why Roman (Shark) says that he is eating ground ... Everything is right! Because it kills the half-period pulse at the reception, which is grounded. This can be seen in all his settings! I wondered for a long time why he decided to use this solution and realized that it's easier to pick up BB diodes. Since interference at such frequencies in Tesla will lead to its improper operation. In other words, it will not be possible to cut off the half-period. Kapa solved this issue with an arrester and rectifiers at low frequencies. There everything is simpler, but more wires .... So on the German installation the diode is small, Tesla is far away, the grounding cable is long. By the way is equal to the length of Tesla !!! Do not forget about grounding .... On this installation it is important and without good support (grounding) will not work. Do not forget that the systems use high voltage. As we know, it moves even in the air. That's why grounding is necessary. Plus wave resonance and safety .... Like that .....

Ref: Ruslan K

 

I know Floyd Sweet and Tariel Kapanadze both had Mains Frequency on the Output, I am guessing, this is just a sub-harmonic, by design, of the system. 

I believe the disconnected wire is just a wire spacing between the primary coil, to reduce Self Induction. Its a thing he did talk about in the Tesla stuff he talked about.

The truth is, the fundamental Method, it cant be all that different, from Floyd Sweet, to Tariel Kapanadze, to us trying to learn what those before us seemed to grasp more easily than we do today.

For example, the Output Coil, it is exposed to the exact same phenomena as the globe:

 

All the subatomic particles will be exposed to the same phenomena, High Voltage changes the state of the particles, you can check for your self:

To change electron states using High Voltage and Modulating Magnetic Fields, physicists rely on the fact that an electron’s energy level and spatial distribution (its "state") are determined by the electromagnetic environment it inhabits. Historically and in modern labs, this is achieved through two primary mechanisms: the Stark Effect (for electric fields) and the Zeeman Effect (for magnetic fields).

 

 

1. High Voltage and the Stark Effect

When a high-voltage electric field is applied to an atom, it physically pulls the electron in one direction and the nucleus in the other. This interaction changes the electron's potential energy.

  • Process: An external electric field (\(E\)) is created by applying a high voltage across two plates. This field interacts with the electron’s position (\(r\)), adding a term to the Hamiltonian (the total energy equation): \[V_{Stark} = -eE \cdot r\]
  • Result: This "stretches" the electron cloud. Energy levels that were once the same (degenerate) split apart.
  • Historical Use: In the early 20th century, Johannes Stark used high-voltage discharge tubes to show that spectral lines of hydrogen would split, proving that electric fields directly modify the internal quantum states of atoms.

 

2. Modulating Magnetic Fields and the Zeeman Effect

Electrons have a property called magnetic moment, which comes from their spin and their orbital motion around the nucleus. Like a tiny compass needle, an electron wants to align with an external magnetic field.

  • Process: When a magnetic field (\(B\)) is applied, the electron's energy depends on its orientation relative to that field. The energy shift is given by: \[\Delta E = -\mu \cdot B\] where \(\mu\) is the magnetic moment.
  • Modulation: By "modulating" the field (changing its strength or frequency), researchers can drive electrons between these split states. This is the basis of Electron Paramagnetic Resonance (EPR).
  • Result: The field "lifts the degeneracy," meaning electrons with different spins (up vs. down) no longer have the same energy.

 

3. Combined Process: State Manipulation

In practice, these two forces are often used together to achieve precise control:

Component Function Effect on Electron High Voltage (Static) Defines the potential "landscape." Shifts and splits orbital energy levels (Stark). Magnetic Field (Static) Defines the spin orientation. Splits states based on magnetic alignment (Zeeman). Modulation (Dynamic) Provides a "kick" at a specific frequency. Induces transitions (jumps) between the newly created states.

 

The "How-To" Summary:

  1. Preparation: Place the sample in a high-voltage environment to define the orbital states.
  2. Splitting: Apply a strong magnetic field to separate the spin states.
  3. Resonance: Modulate a secondary magnetic field (often at radio or microwave frequencies). When the modulation frequency matches the energy gap between states, the electron "flips" its state.

 

The fact of the matter is, Floyd Sweet Wrote about these processes, he was vague and did not go into any detail, but I believe it was a well known phenomena in closed circles, back in the 40's 50's and 60's.

Hey, if I am wrong, then I am happy to say, but, thing is, we do have evidence for this arrangement, it has merit and aligns with Floyds Writings. I have been a bit lazy in the last year or so, and slowed down in my experiments, so some of this is not yet fully investigated. I will get there, in time.

   Chris

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Ere many generations pass, our machinery will be driven by a power obtainable at any point of the universe. This idea is not novel. Men have been led to it long ago by instinct or reason. It has been expressed in many ways, and in many places, in the history of old and new. We find it in the delightful myth of Antheus, who drives power from the earth; we find it among the subtle speculations of one of your splendid mathematicians, and in many hints and statements of thinkers of the present time. Throughout space there is energy. Is this energy static or kinetic? If static, our hopes are in vain; if kinetic - and this we know it is for certain - then it is a mere question of time when men will succeed in attaching their machinery to the very wheelwork of nature.

Experiments With Alternate Currents Of High Potential And High Frequency (February 1892).

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