ISLab's Replication of Basic POC Effect

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ISLab posted this 2 weeks ago

This is my first attempt to replicate the basic POC OU effect.

First I want to thank Chris for this extraordinary site and its amazing content! I only came across it recently and wish I had known of it for the last few years that I have been experimenting. But it is never too late, so I want to start from scratch with POC effect.

Since this is my first post and the interface is very new, please forgive any errors. I will learn and correct as I go along.

My goal is to document in a way that others can also replicate by following my mistakes and successes.

I wound three coils on a 8cm ferrite rod thus:

L2 99 turns CW followed by L3 99 turns CCW

Then L1 on top of L2 with 98 turns CW.

All coils made with 26 SWG.

I tried to pulse L1 with 3.6 volts from standard PSU using IC555 circuit. This did not give any effect as the frequency was too low and I had no idea of what would be the resonant frequency.

The solution was to use Jagau's SRO circuit which automatically oscillates at resonant frequency, which I found to be about 12KHz in this case.

Below are photos and oscilloscope captures.

Coil and SRO circuit by Jagau

In order to get any useful signal on L3, I had to add a resistor and diode in both L2 and L3.

With resistor value of 33 Ohms and diode in opposing directions, I got the following in L3:

Red is pulse going into L1

Yellow is floating signal in L3, without connecting ground which seems to kill the signal.

Zooming in on this:

Slight adjustments on R1 give the following two variations to the pulse:

All the above readings are taken in the junction of the resistor and diode. The following is taken at the junction between L3 and diode:

I'm thrilled to get the ringing waveform but am not sure if I see the OU effect clearly lasting beyond the end of the L1 pulse.

Hence I request your guidance on how to further optimise the effect.

Thank you for your help and guidance!

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ISLab posted this 2 weeks ago

Jagau's SRO circuit is here, taken from "Brian's Eternal Flashlight Replication" thread:

I've subsequently tried to pulse the coil with an IC555 circuit with variable duty cycle like this:

This gives excellent control on duty cycle for low frequencies.

To get close to the 12KHz range, I had to use:

R1 = R2 = 1K, P2 = 1K, P1 = 5K, C1 = 10nF

But with these values the duty cycle barely varies and is in the 30% to 40% range.

I'm feeding this output to an IRF 9540 which gives good pulsing at lower frequencies, but at this range the output waveform gets severely distorted.

I'm still trying to resolve these and will report as soon as I have useful results.

Meanwhile do please suggest if there is a better circuit to accomplish this.

Thank you!

Jagau posted this 2 weeks ago

 Hi

I would suggest that one for your needs

https://aboveunity.com/thread/square-wave-oscillator/

 

Jagau

ISLab posted this 2 weeks ago

Thank Jagau! Very useful.

I've ordered TLC555 which may take a few days to come. But the thread gave me the necessary kick to put together a variation on the pulsing circuit by combining several circuit fragments as sequential functions like this:

pulsing circuit

What is very convenient is that one can separately control Frequency and pulse width (duty cycle). The circuit is small:

The outputs are as below. Red is output at TAP1 and Yellow is at TAP 3 without load of the coil L1.

Placing load of L1 distorts the output slightly like this:

Output on coil L3 (Red) in relation to coil L1 (Yellow) clearly shows energy resonance effect marked in blue circle:

I think the dip in L1 (Yellow) pulse (marked in blue) is from resonance-energy pushing back from the coils into the pulsing circuit. Would be happy to hear your thoughts.

Would this qualify as OU effect? Please guide me on how to proceed next to amplify and/or extract.

Close up of L3 measured across diode:

My ultimate goal is to replicate the Eternal Flashlight circuit! Please suggest next steps to proceed.

Once again, thank you Chris and the AboveUnity team for all your efforts to spread this knowledge and to guide those of us who have been struggling with this for so long! I truly wish I had come across this sooner!

Jagau posted this 2 weeks ago

 Hi Islab
Yes you can do the same with 2 X 555 first one control Frequency and the other one DTC it iscorrect, you ca use only one 555 as the shematic a prpose to you, the TLC is for lower consumption only.

Nice set up, just to tell you more i thing your totem pole driver seems to have too high base drive resistor maybe you calacutate that too havelower milliamp i dont know.

I like that those who are not afraid to make practical experiences, congratulations.


Jagau

 

ISLab posted this 1 weeks ago

your totem pole driver seems to have too high base drive resistor maybe you calacutate that too have lower milliamp

Actually, I did not calculate. Just plugged in from various sources. Thank you for pointing it out. I will correct this in my next. I wanted to complete a last set of tests, so will keep the circuit same till this is done.

My initial coils were set with same number of windings for L1, L2, L3. But elsewhere Chris clearly states L1 should be 1/4 of L2.

So I wanted to test the difference it makes. Since I could not remove L1, I added a new L1 on top, make of 25 turns CW of 18SWG.

Then tested with various positions of the new L1 with respect to L2. Below are the results. Unfortunately, I changed the measurement points of L3 to measure across full L3 coil. So the new measurements cannot be compared to the previous ones.

First set baseline measure of original L1 of 98 turns of 26SWG. Check the values of Vk and Vp of L3 (Red).

Now wind new L1 with 25 turns of 18 SWG, with L1 placed in centre of L2:

Shift the new L1 to left extreme of L2:

Shift to right extreme of L2:

Stretch the new L1 to spread out to fit entire L2 width:

Shift to partially cover extreme left of L2 so that only 16 turns are overlapping L2.

 

Conclusions: The best output is when L1 is on the extreme left of L2. Second best if when on extreme right of L2.

Why is extreme left best? A) best point to "kick" resonance is at an extreme end, B) loosely coupled with L2, C) least interference with L3.

As Nikola Tesla and Don Smith said L1 should be just enough to trigger L2 but not be too tightly coupled as to bind it.

I hope this helps to validate the theory, and helps others in the practice!

ISLab posted this 1 weeks ago

My next step is to try to amplify and optimise the effect with tighter coils (narrower and multi-layered). Based on reading, the following are the guidelines along with some questions:

A) Length of coil wire should be 40m or 37.5m (based on Ruslan text). I understand 37.5 is best for the 50Hz harmonic. Is that the only reason? Or will any length do as long as we get some resonance? I do want to optimise to the maximum effect here.

B) Assuming the latter for (A), both L2 and L3 should be 37.5m each? How close is the tolerance required? Match to millimetres? Or is it ok if it goes off by about a centimetre or so? I'm concerned that wire may stretch or slip slightly during winding.

C) When layering the coil, should the winding be L to R, R to L, L to R, etc? Or should it be L to R, straight line to L, L to R, straight line to L, etc? I understand that the only difference will be build-up of A Vector. But many videos of Akula don't seem to care about this (or did I misunderstand?). My concern is also that "straight to L" will make for sharp corners in wire which may cause losses in resonance. Of course, one can bring to L over a full turn to avoid sharp corners. Is the benefit worth the effort?

D) Air core or ferrite? Chris seems to prefer air-core in some comments. But I don't recall if this was specific to a particular situation.

E) Since resonant frequency will need to be very precise and stable, is a breadboard good enough to work? Or does one need to shift to PCB?

Any advice and guidance for best-practices will be much appreciated! Thank you!

Chris posted this 1 weeks ago

Hello ISLab,

Perhaps the thread: Builders Guide to Aboveunity Machines will help some more?

I see a lot of speculation in your posts, I would like to see more accuracy after you have read the basics of Partnered Output Coils.

 

Learning how Partnered Output Coils "Generate" Electric Power is the primary Goal.

Best Wishes,

   Chris

 

ISLab posted this 6 days ago

Perhaps the thread: Builders Guide to Aboveunity Machines will help some more?

Yes. I was happily overwhelmed with all the information on this website, but confused by sometimes differing content representing earlier and later info spanning over several years. Re-focussing on this one thread has helped to clarify things!

I see a lot of speculation in your posts, I would like to see more accuracy after you have read the basics of Partnered Output Coils.

Apologies! Will not happen again.

Learning how Partnered Output Coils "Generate" Electric Power is the primary Goal.

Since I have not managed to get the Sawtooth waveform, there is no OU generation yet. Will work on this and revert.

I appreciate all the help given here!

With gratitude.

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Melendor posted this 5 days ago

Hello ISlab.
To replicate X effect ,you must have the the hardware as close to possible the same , as the owner of the experiment you want to duplicate \ replicate.
As you see, people use  closed C core,so that the flux circulates in the core.
You must also try around the same Number of turns and wire gauge.
You can do it.
Just read and read and read.
Lots of information here. Wish you good luck.

~~~Melendor the wizard

ISLab posted this 5 days ago

To replicate X effect,you must have the the hardware as close to possible the same as the owner of the experiment you want to duplicate\ replicate. As you see, people use s closed C core,so that the flux circulates in the core. You must also try around the same Nr of turn and wire gauge.

Thanks Melendor. I will do with closed core and revert.

 

Something odd

Meanwhile, since I was trying to get the sawtooth waveform using single ferrite piece, I got some odd results which I am documenting here and seeking comments from anyone.

My L1 is  25 turns CCW sitting on top of L2 of 99 turns CW. Next to both is L3 of 99 turns CCW.

In the original experiment with C core, Chris showed the sawtooth output on L2. In my case L2 is a plain pulse and L3 has the interesting waveform but of much lower voltage:

This is L1 (yellow) and L2 (Red):

L2 is getting the full voltage but of an normal transformer effect.

Here is L3 (Red) and L1 (Yellow):

Voltage is much lower, but more interesting. I understood the lower voltage to mean that there is not enough magnetic resonance between L2 and L3 and not enough counter-reaction. With a closed core or narrower coil this might get corrected.

Then as I was fooling around, I crossed the inside wires of L2 and L3 by mistake (as circled in red) and got a very interesting waveform:

This looks like the sawtooth pattern but across L2 and L3 cross wired. I'm not sure how to interpret this. So just putting it out here in case it is useful or makes sense to anyone.

Chris posted this 5 days ago

Very Well Done ISLab!

Thank You for Sharing! You are on the right track now! Good to see! You will note, this effect can be expanded upon, immensely! Focus on this effect and in the Threads I have shared, how to greatly improve this effect! 

Best Wishes,

   Chris

ISLab posted this 2 days ago

Thank you Chris!

While waiting to wind my new coils I played with the Sawtooth waves some more.

Here are some observations with notes on how I understand it.

When I drop the frequency too low the wave expands and there is a time when generation does not take place (marked in blue circles) which is wasted time:

When frequency is too high, the wave never comes down to 0v level and stays floating (marked with blue). I don't know how to interpret this. Please explain.

When frequency goes still higher, the sawtooth wave degrades too much.

 

New Coils with E-Core

I wound two new narrow coils with 22 SWG for fitting on E-core, with priority on total length of wires instead of number of turns as each layer has significantly different lengths.

Made L3=609cm (+ 10cm + 10cm for connections) CCW and wound Left to Right, curve back to left, Left to Right, etc. Actual turns seems to be a little over 40.

L2=609cm (+ 10cm + 10cm for connections) CW and would Left to Right, curve back to left, Left to Right, etc

L1=152cm (+ 10cm + 10cm for connections) CCW Left to Right, fits in 12 turns.

Fitted both on two E-Core halves and joined with separator gap. Then pulsed with short pulses about 1% duty cycle. But I could only get the sawtooth waveform when the wires were crossed across the coils as earlier:

Sawtooth waveform:

Peak voltage is substantially higher. I tried the same without the gap in E-cores and got:

Peak voltage is slightly higher, but there is a lot of ringing in L1 and a little ringing in L2 also. Is this good / bad?

No sawtooth in recommended circuit

But I am not satisfied as this cross-connection is not shown anywhere on your site. And I cannot get the sawtooth waveform on the single coil as most of the documentation on your site recommends.

When I wired it as suggested in https://aboveunity.com/thread/how-to-build-your-own-above-unity-machine/ like this:

I get only small pulses corresponding to pulses on L1. But when I also add diodes like this:

then there are only long spikes and no sawtooth waves:

So, I'm a little lost here. What am I doing wrong? Please guide me on how to proceed.

Thanking you in advance.

 

Jagau posted this 2 days ago

Hi islab


There is still a lot of research to be done on the development of aboveunity machines.
The guide that is produced on the site is a starting guide and there is a wealth of free information for everyone.
The accompaniment is done by mutual aid and the site does not provide a ready-made recipe, it would be too easy since this site is a support forum. I understand very well that research is not easy but we all work on it here with the same goal

Looking at your experiences I see that you are progressing very quickly and if you continue like this you will reach your goal.

Bravo


Jagau

Chris posted this 2 days ago

Hi ISLab,

Jagau is right! You have come a long way very quickly! It takes some work to understand what's occurring in this setup, that's why I recommend starting small and cheap, just like you have! Well done, I see lots of progress!

Polarity is one problem I see, one of your Partnered Output Coils has the wrong polarity.

I recommend to start like so: Wind POCOne CW, with x Turns, Wind your Input Coil on top with approximately 1/4, or less, of the x turns.

Then Place the Diode on POCOne, making sure the Polarity is right, as if you're building a DC Transformer in the Forward Direction, not in Flyback! Use the Right Hand Rule for this using conventional Current.

Then Wind POCTwo in the CCW Direction and Place the Diode according to the Right Hand Grip Rule also, making sure it opposes POCOne. Then the Sawtooth Waveform will occur.

The other problem I see is not enough turns, 

As Voltage is "Generated" and thus a Current then flows through the load, the Tension, Magnetic Compression is held to a specific Amplitude A, and if the Voltage is not sufficient, then the Sawtooth Waveform drops off before the end of the cycle is reached. That's why there is a Flat bit at the end of the cycle.

You can visualise this in this video:

 

Imagine if the Magnet was switched off 0.75 the way down the copper tube, its the same thing occurring!

This was a bit of a tricky one for me to work out initially!

It all comes back to "Generating" Sufficient Voltage, which is Charge Separation. To do this Magnetic Fields need to be sufficient! Thus me saying "Get your Magnetic Fields Up". The Thread: Coil Geometry is where more information can be seen on this topic.

You're doing really Good! Really nice Build there! Well done! This initial Learning Phase can be steep, buts also fun! Especially when you have the right people around you all working together! For the Common Good!

P.S: I told you I would help! I just expect others to do the first bit themselves and I see you have! Its all about Understanding, this can be taken to any Scale!

Best Wishes,

   Chris

ISLab posted this yesterday

Thank you so much Chris, Jagau and Melendor!

Your words of encouragement and support and guidance are such a help!

I just read Chris' latest post and suggestions. I will make the necessary changes and revert.

Meanwhile

But meanwhile I have been fooling around looking for the natural resonance frequencies of the coils. I removed the tape binding the two E-cores and placed them touching without gap.

Then I hooked up L2 directly to Jagau's SRO and mapped voltages on L2 and L3 on the oscilloscope. Immediately there was a loud "singing" and the L3 waveform showed peaks of 80v with input 3.3v on L2! With input  of 6v the L3 peak shot up to 250v!

Then I swept R1 on the SRO and the frequency changed from 3KHz to 13Khz. Suddenly the two E-cores snapped together like magnets with a very tight grip. This naturally changed the resonant frequency. But with careful sweeping, I found the magnetic field was very strong between 4KHz and 10KHz.

Watching the input current from PSU, there was a single point where it suddenly peaked to 0.5A (from less than 0.1A normally). This seemed to be around 10KHz with a very narrow margin of variation.

Placing a 2mm gap between E-cores raised the natural resonant frequency to nearly double and the range of tight magnetic attraction was not present. The highest Vp was at 11.3Khz.

So I came to the conclusion that there is definitely a good effect when overall magnetism is strong enough. But it looks like my L1 is not generating enough of it.

Then I came to write this report and saw Chris' advice. Wow! Thank you so much, once again!

Will revert with the changes.

ISLab posted this yesterday

I recommend to start like so: Wind POCOne CW, with x Turns, Wind your Input Coil on top with approximately 1/4, or less, of the x turns.

What direction is the Input Coil? So far I have been winding it CCW as I understood that it will be supported by POCTwo counter-action. But now I'm not so sure of the direction.

Should Input Coil also be CW for maximum stimulation of POCOne? Or should it be CCW to get support of POCTwo?

 

scalarpotential posted this 23 hours ago

I was thinking and wondering the following: is CW and CCW really important? Yes will be the answer, but why? Lenz's cMMF is always in the same direction, namely in the direction opposing the primary/causative flux that induces EMF + current, which is allowed or not by how the coils are connected and components like diodes. If there is only 1 winding or many layers but 1 wire width, what determines the direction and effects that are dependent on direction? The induced current, right?

I think CW/CCW is just for convenience, the phase dot helps determining how to connect it.

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ISLab posted this 22 hours ago

Hi ScalarPotential,

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. What you say is true for conventional symmetric systems.

But with asymmetric systems the direction of winding can make a significant difference as shown by Chris in https://aboveunity.com/thread/some-coils-buck-and-some-coils-dont/.

If you think in terms of magnetic field direction only, changing the phase dot is good enough. But if you think in terms of the A Vector field, then there is much more happening than merely direction of magnetism.

Or you can think of it as aetheric flows and visualise the current as dragging the aether and causing a rotation of the aether around the coil. Then the direction of winding is seen to be critical.

With OU experiments we are in unexplored territory, so best to test and verify.

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Melendor posted this 18 hours ago

 

What direction is the Input Coil? So far I have been winding it CCW as I understood that it will be supported by POCTwo counter-action. But now I'm not so sure of the direction.

Should Input Coil also be CW for maximum stimulation of POCOne? Or should it be CCW to get support of POCTwo?


Hello.
The winding direction of L1 (Trigger )  and L2 ( POC1 ) is CW.
Both windings have the same winding direction , one on top of the other.

You can also see this in the Golden coils that are everywhere on the forum.

The Green coil and the POC1 have the same winding direction.

Hope this helps.
Keep reading and do the work...do the work.

~~~Melendor the wizard

Chris posted this 17 hours ago

Hey Guys,

Melendor is correct:

 

I normally wind the Input Coil in the same Direction as POCOne, CW, this is the reference for POCTwo, making POCTwo CCW.

In the Thread: Some Coils Buck and some Coils DONT, you will see there is a difference to the way Coils are wound, which most engineers will say is not true, but experiment yet again proves Conventional Theory Incomplete!

NOTE: Turns Direction is not critical! All Coils work, just some are better than others, get better results with some configurations! This is an experiment you can do for yourself to work out whats best.

It is the Effects, Look for the Effects and work specifically on those, this is where the path forward lays! Answers come from Close Observation of the Effects, and you have the Sawtooth Waveform occuring, closely study why this occurs, and all the answers you need will appear in the threads here: Builders Guide to Aboveunity Machines will make total sense.

Observe the Two Magnetic Waves Slap Together and create a Standing Wave of V x I. Yes Magnetic Fields Cancel to Create, or "Generate" Voltage and therefore Current!

The oppertunity to observe a Machine that is working, even if at the time is not Above Unity, observing how it works, and seeing what needs to be done to improve on it, is a Unique Oppertunity, www.aboveunity.com is the only website to ever, to provide this Oppertunity! The only Website to give Answers to decades old Problems!

Close Observation is very important, most who fail, fail because they do not observe closely enough, and do not see how to improve, to get Above the Unity Boundary! One must always think; Voltage is "Generated" and Current is Pumped, this occurs because of Charge Sepperation. The basic Fundamentals, they are very important, not enough Voltage, there is no way Unity will be surpassed, Ohms Law: I = V / R or V = I x R or P = V x I, its simple Logic!

I really wish more would join in, and show their progress, its a great thing to see, others making progress in a field that has been Stagnated and virtually Voo Do Science for decades, because the Gurus are not smart enough to work out a few simple problems, now become Main Stream, Cheap and Simple, for anyone to do!

"Little Steps for Little Feet - Sir Richard Feynman"

Best Wishes,

   Chris

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